In this special episode of The Remarkable Credit Union podcast, we explore the surprising parallels between beloved folk-rock band, The Avett Brothers, and effective strategies for credit union marketing.
When our host, Katie Stone, discovered that she isn't the only superfan of The Avett Brothers in the credit union movement, she invited Call Federal Credit Union's Director of Marketing & Financial Education, Greta Kidd, and Alternatives Federal Credit Union's Director of Education & Training, Brendan Wilbur, to nerd out with her, and to address this month's BIG question:
What can The Avett Brothers teach us about credit union marketing?
Regardless of where you fall on the spectrum from "Never heard of The Avett Brothers" to "I'm completely obsessed" spectrum, you'll come away with valuable insights about why some folk-rock bands, and some credit unions, rise above the rest.
Katie Stone:
Welcome to another episode of The Remarkable Credit Union Podcast. We created our podcast to help credit union leaders think outside of the box about marketing, technology, and community impact. The Remarkable Credit Union is brought to you by PixelSpoke, a digital marketing agency that works with credit unions to create user-friendly, high-converting, award-winning websites. As a B corp and an employee-owned cooperative, we believe that business can and should be a force for good. Each episode, we bring on expert guests from the credit union and broader cooperative movement for conversations about the intersection of marketing and social impact. Our goal is to challenge your preconceptions about business as usual and provide you with actionable takeaways that you can use to grow your membership, improve the financial health of your cooperative, and better serve your community.
I'm Katie Stone, CEO and a co-owner here at PixelSpoke. Today is a very special episode of The Remarkable Credit Union Podcast. That's because we'll be answering the big question, which today is what can The Avett Brothers teach us about credit union marketing? To help us answer this question, we have two very special guests. We have Greta Kidd, who serves as the director of marketing and outreach at Call Federal Credit Union in Richmond, Virginia, and Brendan Wilbur, who is the education and training director at Alternatives Federal Credit Union in Ithaca, New York. Not only are Brendan and Greta both credit union development educators, actually Greta and I were both in the same best class ever, but we also all three share a passion for the music of The Avett Brothers. When I discovered this, I just felt like it was a sign from the universe that the three of us should connect and discuss how our shared passions for The Avett Brothers and the credit union movement overlap.
Thank you so much for joining us, Greta and Brendan.
Greta Kidd:
Thank you for having me.
Katie Stone:
Yeah, we're excited to have this conversation. I'd love to start with just the basics. Maybe, Brendan, you'd kick us off. I'd love to hear how many times you've seen The Avett Brothers in concert, and what is about them that draws you to their music?
Brendan Wilbur:
I first saw The Avett Brothers in 2007. It was by happenstance. They were at a music festival that I frequent. They were there and I find myself like a moth drawn to a light, I couldn't walk away. The energy, the stories that they were singing about, the crowd that was gathering. It was really quite amazing.
Since then, I've seen them over 60 times. What draws me back is the energy, the community of people that I meet at the shows, and really the music. It really moves me, it connects with me. It's kind of an antidepressant for me. If I'm having a hard time, The Avett Brothers really lift my spirits.
Katie Stone:
That's awesome. It reminds me a little bit of my first show. Though I've not seen them 60 times. Greta, how about you?
Greta Kidd:
I thought I would have the lead, but gosh. 34-
Katie Stone:
Okay.
Greta Kidd:
... times, with two more on the horizon, two in May here in Richmond, and then going to Wolf Trap up in Northern Virginia. Really, just love these guys.
This is a funny story. I first saw them in 2018 at Red Rocks. I hadn't really listened to them, didn't know much about them, but my husband told me to watch the documentary about the brothers, May It Last: A Portrait of the Avett Brothers. I just fell in love with their story. Once you hear the story, and you see and learn more about their family dynamics, their father Jim who follows them all over the place and will get up and sing with them, and their sister, it just made me appreciate them more as people, as human beings. Then just brought it all to life when we went to Red Rocks for the first time. Red Rocks for the first time to see The Avett Brothers, pretty phenomenal.
Katie Stone:
That is great. Well, I am definitely in the rear. I've only seen them 13 times. Always working on it, though. I, too, saw them by happenstance the first time. I had a really good friend who told me that he was really getting into them. It was his birthday so I bought tickets for us to go just because I thought I love seeing live music. Yeah, I was blown away. Devout fan ever since. Lots of commonality there.
I don't know, Brendan, what you were saying really reminded me a lot of folks in the credit union movement, too. Just around the sense of community, common shared passion. I think there are a lot of connections we can draw on.
Speaking of credit unions, let's pull it all together. We know The Avett Brothers have built this incredibly loyal fan base, as evidenced by the number of times the folks in this room have seen them play. And they do it with a lot of authenticity and emotional connection. I'd love to start by just asking how the two of you see credit unions being able to learn from the way they build their brand. What are the takeaways that we can apply to our credit unions? Greta, why don't we start with you this time?
Greta Kidd:
Well, I think you get two different extremes of their music. You can get a quiet ballad, like Murder in the City, or a really stronger track, like I and Love and You, and their songs are like journal entries, almost like our members' stories. When they're coming in or we're out in the community serving, and hearing what folks are going through, and the highs and the lows, it reminds me of The Avett Brothers because it's unfiltered, it's reflective, and it's about just humanity in itself. Just reminding that we're all human, too.
When you listen to their music and you listen to the words and how poetic it is, it's like a balm. It's soothing and calming. That's, I believe as a credit union, that's what we're here to do. Not only to serve, but to be that uplifting spirit, that balm that just tries to provide peace and comfort when times are great and to also celebrate.
Katie Stone:
Great. Well said. Yeah, lots of I'm hearing authenticity.
Greta Kidd:
Yes.
Katie Stone:
In the stories they tell, and in our members' stories, too. Yeah. Brendan, how about you?
Brendan Wilbur:
You took the word right out of my mouth, it's being authentic. Like I said, I started seeing them in 2007. They are the same people they were back then. They haven't let fortune and fame change who they are or what they're trying to do. They are still holding true the same values. The band has grown, the music has gotten cleaner. It has been cleaned up, it sounds even better. But they haven't lost who they are. They are consistent with their messaging. They have a connection with the audience through shared stories that are relatable to what people are going through. The themes that they choose to sing about are things that we can all think back to a time where that's part of our lives, whether they're the happy songs or the sad songs, or songs that are just dealing with big life issues. They're things that we can all relate back to and I think they do it in such an authentic way. They're sharing pieces of themselves and opening their lives and lettings us in a little bit.
From the credit union side, is how are we true to who we are? What's our mission? What are we trying to do in our communities and how do we stay true to that mission? I think what it comes back to me is how do we stay authentic? How do we stay that credit union that we started 30, 40, 70, 80 years ago? How do we keep that mission, the people we're here to serve at the forefront of our thoughts?
Katie Stone:
Yeah, definitely. I don't know, the thing that was coming up for me was thinking about how important it is to know what your identity is, to understand what your mission is as a credit union. And then, taking that one step further, really being true to that, keeping that as your north star and letting that guide how you operate. That's great, thank you.
Greta Kidd:
I wonder if The Avett Brothers have a mission statement?
Katie Stone:
Yeah.
Greta Kidd:
That just keeps going forward.
Katie Stone:
Yeah. And also, how has that evolved over time? All of our mission statements can change even though the core of who we are might remain the same. Yeah, really interesting.
Well, speaking of storytelling, that is certainly one of their biggest strengths. You guys talked about a lot of these themes, whether it's about loss, or love, or life's big questions, or songs about divorce. There's songs about going through hard times. They really touch on everything. That's something that credit unions could and should, and often do a lot of is as well, which is storytelling as a way to connect with members.
I'm wondering if you have any examples of great storytelling you've see in credit union marketing? Brendan, I'll kick this one over to you.
Brendan Wilbur:
Fantastic. I'm going to be selfish and highlight my own credit union to start. One of my favorite pieces that we do is when we're doing member stories, we're taking somebody's journey. We highlight something called the credit path, which is people's journey towards asset ownership. Starting as a transactor, moving on to a saver, becoming a borrower, and then moving to that final stage of becoming an asset owner, as we want our members to move toward asset ownership, whether that's a bank account, a good credit score, $500 in their savings account. Or maybe starting a business or buying a home. These are assets that affect people's lives.
In our annual reports and in our website, we've been able to capture a bunch of stories over the years. Looking at this podcast coming up, I said, "Let me just reflect on one of these stories." I was able to read a story of Charles Brown, who is a member of ours, who used a really unique mortgage product that we came out with called the Fair Mortgage. Which is financing addressing inequalities in racism, and it's a mortgage designed to help people who are not able to get through the traditional mortgage process. The FHA underwriting, they need to have a down payment, credit score. Charles' story highlights that he just needed someone to believe in him. Someone to sit down with him, tell him that he could do it, and then lay out a map of how he could do it.
His story isn't a unique one. It's someone we can all relate to. It's somebody who grew up without financial education who wanted to own a home, but didn't know where to turn to for information. Luckily, someone turned him on to our mortgage department here and they walked him through the process, connected him with other community programs. He was able to buy a home in October of last year which he worked for for a number of years, but he needed someone to believe in him. That member story that's relatable that we can see ourselves in, our community members can see themselves in, but they also see the pieces along that journey that could help get them to where they want to be.
It wasn't a Charles walked, said "I want to get a home," and we're like, "We got you right away." No. It was, "Here's a path. Here's how we can help you." Then to show that it's possible through the hard work that he put in. And the support that he was given through our employees, he was able to make a dream come true. It's these little stories that can have huge ripples that go out into the community, but it's finding those stories and being able to capture them. That's one that really stuck out to me, it's a really recent one, but those are the ones that I've always loved the most. The ones where the members give their time to share back how their journey was shaped, not through anything remarkable, but just through somebody believing in them and someone taking the time to sit with them, share their journey, share their dream, and give them some guidance along the way.
Katie Stone:
Yeah, definitely. I think there's so much power in member stories. It's one thing for the credit union to tell, "Here's what we can offer," but to have an example that other members can look to and say, "That's someone like me who was able to get through this process," is just so powerful. Yeah, thanks for sharing that.
Greta, anything you want to add there?
Greta Kidd:
I absolutely agree. I think everyone comes with a story that they want to share and they're just wondering if somebody wants to listen to them.
Katie Stone:
Yeah.
Greta Kidd:
We hear a lot of them as well and we have weekly sales calls with our team. That's what it's all about. Each of our retail team members, managers, lending team, they're telling stories about how they're making that positive impact on people's lives. What they thought they would not be able to receive is something that we've been able to uplift, and put them in a better place and space. It's encouraging and I believe that's what The Avett Brothers do. They encourage you to keep going, to keep trying to be your best self, but knowing that it's okay if you falter a little bit, too. Just pick yourself back up.
Katie Stone:
Yeah. Many lyrics are going through my head right now. Yeah, Brendan, I just also wanted to follow up and say that we're big fans of the Fair Mortgage product you all have. I think you know that we actually had Jerome on the podcast a few months back to talk about it. It's a really cool product. We appreciate you guys putting that together.
The Avett's often write songs about real life struggles, we've talked a lot about those here. Money is really one of life's biggest stressors. And yet, financial education can sometimes feel really dry or impersonal. I'm curious to hear how you think credit unions can use storytelling in financial education specifically to help members navigate these challenges and make smarter financial decisions while keeping members engaged? We often see a lot of financial education that is focused around things like not buying a latte every day, which is great advice if you've got the budget for a latte, but we know that a lot of folks don't. Just love to hear how you can incorporate storytelling into that financial education piece and help guide members on their journey?
Brendan Wilbur:
I'm so excited about this question, as I had the privilege of being a financial counselor and financial educator here at Alternatives for about 15 years. It was a real learning experience for me. One, my own financial education, my own knowledge gathering. My own sense of shame around not knowing these things that maybe I should know as an adult. Things that I should have picked up along the way. But I came to Alternatives with a credit score in the 400s. I wasn't given financial advice, I wasn't given financial education. But here I was, in my 20s and I thought, "I should know all these things," and it was hard to ask for help.
Well, when I started, I was offered help at Alternatives. They asked me about my credit score and they said, "Tell us about your credit score," and they asked for my story. They didn't assume a story, they wanted to know how someone could have such a terrible credit score. I got to tell them my story of going to college, being offered Twizzlers to fill out a credit card application, I didn't have a job. I was like, "I just wanted Twizzlers, I liked Twizzlers at the time." And how that enabled me to get into so much debt and to make a lot of poor financial decisions because of predatory loans and being taken advantage of.
Coming into the credit union world, taking advantage of the products and services that we had, using that to build my knowledge and skills, and then being able to practice those with others. What I found was really powerful is this idea of storytelling. It's not saying, "Hey, here's what you should do." It's sharing, "Hey, here's what I did. Here's what worked for me. Here's what I'm doing around my finances." It's taking the shame and the feelings of inadequacy around money away.
One of the biggest things around that is I never encouraged anyone to have a budget unless they're looking at an emergency. If they're going to lose their home, foreclosure, we might need to have an austerity budget for a couple of months to get you back on your feet. But for the most part it was, "What are your values? Where is your money going? Is your money lining up with your values?" I think giving advice to low income people on savings is offensive, honestly. Low income people are some of the hardest workers. They are so smart in navigating government programs, which are set up to keep them poor. They're not allowed to save money. If they get too much money saved, they lose benefits.
One of the things that I really worked on was my empathy, learning what people are going through, and then sharing my own story, what worked for me, and taking the shame off of, "I didn't know these things. I had problems. I had issues." I still have financial problems and issues, and I'm still looking to others to talk to them. Because when we share and we bring others into the conversation, now we're starting to get, one, we take the shame off because we're talking about it. We're looking for resources by having others come into the conversation. What I've found is by sharing our own stories, we're able to bring more people along on that journey. When we're not saying, "Hey, just do this or do that," and we're giving them things to try.
One of my favorite things I would tell people is if there was one way to manage money to work for everyone, I would just give you a handout, we wouldn't need to meet a bunch of times, we wouldn't need to do this class. You could just do this and it would work. I say, "We're all different, we're all brought up differently. We come from different families, different experiences. We have different values, different wants, and we have different needs in our lives. You get to choose where those things go." So I'm empowering people around their financial decisions, while also educating them on why the system and how the system is set up to keep people poor in a lot of ways.
That was a lot of my strategy and it involves making personal connections, it involves being vulnerable yourself so that people feel more comfortable being vulnerable with their own situation. It also allows them to see themselves as, "I'm not less than, I just haven't had access to the information, or knowing where I could access to the information that could help my life." I think first and foremost, it's not about selling a product or a service, it's about developing relationships and building trust. You do that through having conversations, relatable conversations.
Much like, bringing it back to The Avett Brothers, it's we all have these same, we've all had experiences. How do we feel we can share with others so we can bring them along on that journey? That's what The Avett Brothers do through their music, they bring us along on that journey. Through financial education, we can do that through sharing our own stories, our own pitfalls, our own mistakes, but also our own accomplishments and how proud they made us feel, and getting people inspired to follow that same kind of journey.
Greta Kidd:
Just to tag on to that, Brendan, goodness, you should be a poet, a songwriter. That's beautiful. But I think some people just become like a dead fish going with the flow. When you hear someone else's story that may be in your same shoes, you just feel a sense of encouragement and feel like you're ready for a change, you're ready to do something a little different to change up the tired, old routine, and to create a new rhythm in your life. And to know that your credit union is going to support you every step of the way. There's a reason why there are financial wellness departments in credit unions, to walk alongside every individual so you feel included and part of that credit union family, and you get all the vibes and all the feels, and just know that they've got you every step of the way.
Katie Stone:
Yeah. I think that this is an incredibly important message. Brendan, your story resonated a lot with me. When I was in college, I remember my freshman year, it wasn't Twizzlers, but I wanted the free T-shirt. It was a super cool T-shirt, so I signed up for my first credit card. It was a couple years later, after many, many increases to my credit limit that I called my parents and was like, "I'm in trouble. I need some help here." Much like you, I just didn't have, yeah, the knowledge to really know how to effectively manage my finances. A lot of times, you just have to learn that through experience. But how much better to have a financial institution, and especially a credit union, supporting you every step of the way.
All right, let's talk about loyalty again. We've already touched on the fact that Avett Brothers fans are incredibly loyal, as I think the three of us can attest. They travel for concerts, they collect merch. I can see Greta's poster behind her. I've got a portfolio full of them myself. Credit unions also talk a lot about member loyalty. I'd love to hear what lessons you both see that credit unions can take away from the Avetts in how they engage with their fans. Greta, why don't you start this time?
Greta Kidd:
I just think we keep saying that word authenticity, they're just authentic. They're there for all the ages. I have a 17-year-old daughter that is a huge Avett Brothers fan, so now we're buying additional tickets to all the shows so she can come. I love that because now it's become a family affair. But they also live it on stage and they bring their father out there to sing with them, and their sister's singing with them. They stay loyal to each other. You don't see the band breaking up or getting new bandmates, or whatever. They stay loyal to each other and they take care of one another.
That's the whole reason why their successful and how credit unions can be successful, too. That they take care of each other and always there for one another. They're there for all ages, truly. It's crazy to go to these shows, and you see the little babies out there with the headphones on. Then you also see the 90-year-old out there too, jamming away and having the time of their life. I think that's what makes them really well-rounded in their community, too.
Katie Stone:
Thanks, Greta. How about you, Brendan?
Brendan Wilbur:
Yeah. Just to build off of that, they come across with shared values. They don't hide or back away from what their values are. They talk about them, they sing about them. They encourage you to also sing about them. They tell you, "Never be embarrassed to sing." They want people to be engaged in their concerts. They don't want you to just sit down and hear them, they want you to get up, dance, sing with them. Be a part of the experience because it's not just about them, it's about the community that's forming around them.
I also see that they inspire people through what they're doing and what they're bringing forward. I am in my late 40s now, and as an early 40-year-old, I joined a sticker club to get stickers from other Avett Brothers fans called Say Love. I never wanted to be in a sticker club any time in my life. Here is a 40-year-old, I'm mailing stickers out to people that I don't know with little Avett Brothers stickers. Why? Because there's a sense of shared passion, there's a sense of shared values, and there's a sense of community that comes from the group.
My first internet friends I ever made in my were in my 30s and they were on an Avett Brothers' message board group. They have been a part of so many firsts in my life because they inspire me to meet others who share that same passion for the music.
As a credit union, if we're living our values and our commitment to the community, we're going to inspire people to want to be a part of what we're doing. We are making a difference in people's lives on a daily basis. If we as a credit union are focused, not on what our bottom line, but on what our mission and our values are, that is where we're building that community, that shared connection, and that passion that our members will have for wanting to engage with us. It's not a matter of us going to engage with them. We want them to engage with us because they're getting inspired by the work that we're doing. It goes back to that member stories. It goes back to how do we share the work that we're doing to people so we can inspire them? Not just so they have a checking account, but so they want to send their friends to us, so they want to make sure that we're doing as best as we can so that they can do as best as they can as well.
Katie Stone:
Yeah, I really love that last point. You want them to bring their family and their friends to the credit union, much like I feel like all three of us were introduced to The Avett Brothers. We didn't know what we were getting into with our first concert. Someone brought us into the fold and look at what it created. Love the stickers, too. When I was in DE training with Greta, she gave me a sticker and I mailed one to her more recently. Yeah, let's keep the sticker exchange going, too.
Greta Kidd:
I love putting them on my notebooks, my journals for work.
Katie Stone:
Yeah. Well, The Avett Brothers have built a career on sincerity and the word of the day, authenticity. Seth once said, sorry, Seth Avett, for those of you not in the know, once said, "It's real difficult to sound sincere on a microphone." Somehow, the Avetts have overcome that challenge. But I'd love to talk a little bit about how that same challenge applies to credit union marketing, especially in a world where so many folks are skeptical of financial institutions. How can credit unions ensure their messaging feels genuine, rather than overly polished or sales-driven? What thoughts do you have on that, Brendan?
Brendan Wilbur:
I listen to The Avett Brothers all the time, but knowing this podcast was coming up, I went a little deeper over the last week. I was like, "You know, I'm going to really pay attention to some of these lyrics." Something that resonated for me from the song Ain't No Man and it was, "You got to show up if you want to be seen." It's not about just what we're putting on our website, what we're putting out in the community as far as advertisements the marketing, it's we have to show up in our communities that we want to serve.
I heard this message over and over again. Not as eloquently as in that one line in Ain't No Man, but if you want to show up in your marketing, you have to be seen. That means we have to be in the communities. We need to show up where the people are that we are here to serve. That means going to the community centers, going to the elementary schools, going to the food pantries. I'm really proud to say we're working to do that more and more at Alternatives. We require staff to have outreach hours so that they're going out to the community. They can pick and choose, but we want them to be in the community. We want them to not go there to sell, we want them to go there to connect. To hear what the community needs, to make relationships because we feel that's how you get to be authentic. It's hard to do it behind a webpage, it's hard to do it through marketing, you do it through the people that you hire and then you put out into the community.
Bringing the people in that you hire, it's really important that you're hiring people from the community you're trying to serve as well. We want our staff to look like the people that we're here to serve. We want them to be from the communities that we're serving. That one line really resonated with me and it got me so excited. That was one of the things where I was like, "Oh, that's a new light bulb, it's a new Avett moment for me." I'm like, "Look at this, you got to show up if you want to be seen." That really, really resonates for me. I was talking to our CEO here today and I was like, "The Avett Brothers had it right all along. See, here's what we should be doing and we are doing." He looked at me like I was crazy and he was just happy that I thought we were doing the right thing.
Katie Stone:
That's great. I'm hearing that lyric and that song in a whole new light now, so thanks for sharing that. How about you, Greta?
Greta Kidd:
The word that comes to mind is consistency. When Seth says it's real difficult to sound sincere on a microphone, if you go from one show, to another, to another, there's different nuances, but the energy on the stage, it's always consistent I feel like. You know what to expect. In marketing, we've got to keep that consistency in the forefront, that intentionality to live out our mission, to live out our values.
At our credit union, our values are authenticity and to collaborate with one another, and to innovation. Not just in the technology side of things, but also in the problem solving side of things, you got to get creative sometimes.
Katie Stone:
Yeah.
Greta Kidd:
And to be optimistic, to uplift folks. That's what I feel like their songs bring out and that just carries with them. It provides them another layer of they are the real deal. When you do that in the credit union movement, and it's got consistency, and you're always pointing back to the mission, you're always reminding your team what the mission is, why we are here. Why is there a credit union movement? Why was it the little man under the umbrella? We're part of something so much bigger and in bringing the team along on that ride just makes you authentic and gives that sincerity. They come to know what to expect.
Katie Stone:
Yeah, really well said. Thanks.
Well, The Avett Brothers, one of the things I love about them is that they keep their music, lots of raw vocals, acoustic instruments, really heartfelt lyrics, as we've talked about. Sometimes we see that credit unions can over-complicate their messaging. I'm wondering how we can apply the less is more approach to marketing. What's one marketing gimmick you think credit unions should drop in favor of a more genuine approach? Greta, let's start with you this time.
Greta Kidd:
I think it's really important to lead with why. Why do we believe? I also think it's even more important that we really strategize our messaging so it's targeted to that person that we believe would benefit from that, too. I'm not a big fan of just broadcasting a campaign, a promotion, or whatever to everyone in the credit union when you know that they've paid off their card. You can learn a lot in that data.
I agree, simplify the language. Drop the jargon. Safe free budgeting tools instead of personal financial management or financial coaching. We're here to offer the tools that you need to be successful budgeting. Then also, let the visuals and the story speak, which we've been talking about a lot. A photo of a real member, of a quote, or a testimonial from someone can go so much further than whatever that rate may be. That might be what's the icing on the cake to say, "Yes, I want to give them a try."
Again, if you're doing everything with the right heart, with the right purpose, and the mindset, it shouldn't be gimmicky, it should be authentic, it should be real. That is what we strive to do at Call Federal Credit Union. If we do the right things, then we will be rewarded in a way that surpasses financial budgets, and that sort of thing.
Katie Stone:
Definitely. Thanks. How about you, Brendan?
Brendan Wilbur:
That was a great answer. I was going to lead in a very similar way. It's about the why, focusing on the why we exist, why we're here. I was thinking more along the lines of stop competing with banks and other credit unions. Really looking at what our niche is, who are we trying to serve, and how do we connect with them and tell our stories. Because our messages, we're honestly not here for everyone.
At Alternatives Federal Credit Union, we have a very specific group of people we want to work with. Low income, BIPOC, and people of color. We want to work with people who have been historically disenfranchised. We want to market directly to them, we want to talk to them about why, why we want to do that. We don't want to compete with anyone else because we think we have products that are tailored for our market and the people that we've identified are the folks that we want to help on that credit path.
Katie Stone:
We talk about that a lot at PixelSpoke. It's not about being the best, it's about a specific combination of services that is really what your clients or members in your case need. That resonates a lot.
What both of you said actually reminded me a lot of something we did at DE training, which was that empathy mapping. Just really understanding who our members are, what is going through their minds, what are they thinking about, what's keeping them up at night, and then deciding how can we serve them. Going back to the why is really the starting point.
All right, this is a big question, but I'd love to hear if you could pick an Avett Brothers song that embodies the spirit of credit unions, which one would it be and why? Brendan, you're up first this time.
Brendan Wilbur:
This is so difficult.
Katie Stone:
I bet.
Brendan Wilbur:
I have a couple for different reasons.
Katie Stone:
Okay.
Brendan Wilbur:
It's not exactly just the credit union spirit, but a couple of them are around where I think credit unions are. The first one is Perfect Space. Perfect Space is all about maturing, growing up, and wondering if people are still going to like you as you change and as you age, and wanting to age gracefully, I think our credit union industry, we're getting older. We're not seeing as many new credit unions, we're seeing credit unions merge, we're seeing credit unions become more mature and age in years that they've been in service. It's how do we ensure that we are still being true to ourselves? Not actually worry about what other people think, but making sure we're staying true to ourselves. I got that message out of that song.
The other one that was resonating with me is Back Into the Light. Back Into the Light, I was thinking about rediscovering the purpose of credit unions, people helping people. Getting back to the mission and why credit unions were formed in the first place. Not to be an alternate to banks, but really to serve a very particular group of people who weren't being served any other way.
Both of those hit me in different ways. One getting us back to the mission, Back Into the Light. Then, Perfect Space, looking at us as an aging industry and how do we stay true to ourselves.
Katie Stone:
Perfect Space is one of my favorites. The list is long, though. How about you, Greta?
Greta Kidd:
Head Full of Doubt, Road Full of Promise. I think this song speaks to facing uncertainty with hope, an idea that credit unions embody every day. Members often come to us with financial fears, doubts, big life decisions. Our role is to be that steady guide, helping them create a clear path, believe in what's possible, and move forward with confidence. That line, "Decide what to be and go be it," and then it's the drum. Then, "It was a dream." It just feels like a rallying cry for credit unions and their members alike. It's about empowerment. It's about providing them the education, the information that they need to make the best decision for themselves, regardless of what their past looks like because everyone deserves that.
It's about taking control of your story and it's about having a trusted partner. That would be the credit union, in my humble opinion, to help you get there. The song balances realism with optimism, too. And authenticity. All the words, you can see the consistency in their music. But it's acknowledging life's struggles, but choosing hope anyway. That's the same balance credit unions aim to strike in every conversation, in every practical financial solution we offer, and every community initiative to make that positive impact. That's what we're here to do. Decide what to be and go be it, and know we're here for you.
Katie Stone:
I love it. On the PixelSpoke website, that is my life slogan actually. That might be my favorite song to hear live. Love it. Thank you.
Greta Kidd:
Yes.
Katie Stone:
Yes, great. All right, let's jump into some rapid fire questions. Greta, let's start with you. What is your favorite Avett Brothers song?
Greta Kidd:
Laundry Room. If you've been to their show, you know the disco ball comes down and it starts ramping up. I am just jumping up and down like a kid again, hoping my knees and feet don't give out as they get into it. I love Laundry Room, my favorite.
Katie Stone:
Awesome. Yeah. How about you, Brendan?
Brendan Wilbur:
It's November Blue.
Katie Stone:
All right. Cool, cool. All right. What is the best non-Avett Brothers concert you have ever been to? Brendan, you're up first this time.
Brendan Wilbur:
I used to go see Medeski Martin & Wood all the time. I used to travel around and follow them in my younger days. I saw them at a venue here in New York, Albany, New York called The Egg. Which, if you've never heard of The Egg or seen it, there's a giant egg that's suspended up in the air. It's pretty remarkable. The sound is absolutely unbelievable. Medeski Martin & Wood had one of the best shows I'd ever seen them perform. What was really memorable was everybody was yelling out what songs they want to hear, and I yelled out, "Play whatever you want." John Medeski looked at me, the crowd cheered. It was one of those moments of I said the perfect thing in the right time. I'll never forget that day, it was a great show.
Katie Stone:
Cool. Sounds like an awesome venue. I've seen the Wood Brothers a couple times, yeah. How about you, Greta, favorite non-Avetts concert you've been to?
Greta Kidd:
I had thought Nathaniel Rateliff, but then I'm thinking back to a year ago in Charlottesville, Dawes came. They brought Lucius with them. Dawes would sing a song and Lucius would be back up. They were both on the stage together. Then Lucius would sing a song and Dawes was their backup. That was just super cool and it was so fun. That was great.
Katie Stone:
That sounds awesome. I saw Lucius with The War and Treaty and The National maybe six months ago.
Greta Kidd:
They have a new album coming out, too.
Katie Stone:
All right. Finally, what's a concert venue you haven't been to, but would like to? Greta, you're first this time.
Greta Kidd:
The Gorge.
Katie Stone:
Oh, you haven't been. Okay. How about you, Brendan?
Brendan Wilbur:
Well, Greta's been talking about it and rubbing it in my face. It's Red Rocks.
Katie Stone:
I know. Me, too. Me, too. I'm going to Denver actually here in about a week, but there's just not a show compelling enough to be my first Red Rocks show. I got to make it memorable. Yeah.
Well, I'd like to close by just doing an Our Final Take. As a reminder, our big question today was what can The Avett Brothers teach us about credit union marketing? I'd love it if the two of you can just sum up your thoughts in a sentence or two. I'll start with you, Brendan.
Brendan Wilbur:
It's really looking at being authentic, true to yourself, and it's about showing up in your communities. Those are my big takeaways. It's not trying to put on fancy clothes, not trying to be someone you're not. Be the credit union you're formed to be, get out into your communities, make connections. Bring people along the journey you're trying to create. Build those relationships. The Avett Brothers would be proud of you.
Katie Stone:
That's great. How about you, Greta?
Greta Kidd:
Ditto, that was amazing. I would say it's the consistency of it all and remember what's important. To them, you can see it, it's family. Then telling those stories to encourage others. All the while, they're being authentic, they're being optimistic, and they're giving hope because there's hope for sure.
Katie Stone:
I love that. Great ending. Thanks so much to both of you for being here.
Greta Kidd:
Thank you.
Brendan Wilbur:
Thanks so much.
Katie Stone:
Well, that was a really fun episode of The Remarkable Credit Union Podcast. It's not often that you get the chance to share in conversation with other fans of The Avett Brothers, much less tie it all back to the work we do.
Let's talk about some key takeaways. First of all, I think that we learned that authenticity builds loyalty, whether it's in music or in credit unions. Just as The Avett Brothers have cultivated a tremendously loyal fan base by staying true to their values and sharing deeply personal stories, credit unions can also foster loyalty by remaining authentic to their mission. When credit unions show up in their communities and stay connected to the why behind their work, they become trusted partners, not just another financial institution.
Secondly, storytelling is the heart of financial empowerment. Both of our guests today emphasized that member stories like overcoming credit challenges or buying a first home can be much more impactful than traditional financial education. Sharing real journeys, including missteps and successes, creates empathy, it builds trust, and it demystifies the financial system for members who may feel left out or ashamed.
Then finally, keep it simple and purpose-driven. The Avett Brothers' music is straightforward, it's emotional, it's clear, and credit union marketing should really follow suit. Ditch the jargon and the mass market promotions in favor of a targeted, human-centric message that reflects members' lived experiences. A clear sense of purpose and consistent values should guide every communication.
Well, thanks again for joining us today for another great episode. The Remarkable Credit Union is brought to you by PixelSpoke, a digital marketing agency that works with credit unions to create user-friendly, high-converting, award-winning websites. As a B corp and an employee-owned cooperative, we believe that business can and should be a force for good. You can learn more and check out our work at pixelscope.coop. That's PixelSpoke, all one word, dot C-O-O-P. Until the next time, I wish you the best of luck in making your credit union remarkable.